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#251358 - 09/08/12 03:44 AM Re: Miss Moo is off her rocker :( [Re: bianca]
MaxaLisa Offline

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Registered: 01/26/10
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Most of that bloodwork is right down the middle, isn't it?

I have a few observations, and I don't know what they mean, if anything. Bloodwork is a shot in time and it could be all different tomorrow, but....

The high haemaglobin, goes along with the high normal Hct. The RBC is in the upper normal, but nothing that anyone just looking at that alone would think twice about. I'm thinking this is related somehow to the high normal bicarbonate, but I have no idea what the relationship is.

All the blood counts (neutrophils, lymphocytes, monocytes, eosinophils, basophils) are all normal. Almost all of them are lower than the midpoint of their normal regions, except for the monocytes, which is in the higher normal region. Looking at the percentages, the monocytes are at the high end of the percentage of the blood they should normally take up.

Don't know if any of that means anything, nothing is *really* wrong!

How is she doing? Any respiratory problems? Is she getting enough water?
_________________________
MaxaL (aka LisaT)

Jazmine, mini-mix, 10/18/2011
Max-n-Indy
Max, 5/2001-2/2012, RIP my partner, my Regal Boy
Indy, 5/1997-10/2010, RIP my friend, my teacher

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#251359 - 09/08/12 04:18 AM Re: Miss Moo is off her rocker :( [Re: MaxaLisa]
bianca Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 05/14/10
Posts: 8875
Loc: Queensland. Australia
Likes: 149
Thank you for looking Lisa smile

I have no idea what any of it means really! No respiratory issues and she has always gulped a lot of water. She seems more herself but the the last few days we have had really strong winds so that upsets her a bit.
_________________________
Molly Moo (aka The Piranha, 4 legged mouth) GSD (31/10/09)
Cooper GSD (The Gremlin) 19/10/11
Texas - Tabby cat (Feb 1996-2013) Run free sweet Teppie
Paris - Tabby cat (Feb 1996-2013) Run free my beautiful girl.

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#251387 - 09/08/12 11:16 AM Re: Miss Moo is off her rocker :( [Re: bianca]
MaxaLisa Offline

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Then. I guess I wouldn't worry about the bloodwork, but I would repeat in a year if nothing happens sooner, just to make sure.

These acid/alkaline things are really complicated, I don't really understand them, and have googled the heck out of them for isues both indy and max had at different times. Just for reference, I'll put this link and quote here in case we need it in a year wink

Here is a process I don't think is happening, but gives a clue how the bicarb and hct/hemoglobin can be related: http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Obesity_hypoventilation_syndrome

Quote:
episodes of nighttime acidosis (e.g. due to sleep apnea) lead to compensation by the kidneys with retention of the alkali bicarbonate. This normalizes the acidity of the blood. However, bicarbonate stays around in the bloodstream for longer, and further episodes of hypercapnia lead to relatively mild acidosis and reduced ventilatory response in a vicious circle.[2][8]

Low oxygen levels lead to hypoxic pulmonary vasoconstriction, the tightening of small blood vessels in the lung to create an optimal distribution of blood through the lung. Persistently low oxygen levels causing chronic vasoconstriction leads to increased pressure on the pulmonary artery (pulmonary hypertension), which in turn puts strain on the right ventricle, the part of the heart that pumps blood to the lungs. The right ventricle undergoes remodeling, becomes distended and is less able to remove blood from the veins. When this is the case, raised hydrostatic pressure leads to accumulation of fluid in the skin (edema), and in more severe cases the liver and the abdominal cavity.[2]

The chronically low oxygen levels in the blood also lead to increased release of erythropoietin and the activation of erythropoeisis, the production of red blood cells. This results in polycythemia, abnormally increased numbers of circulating red blood cells and an elevated hematocrit.[2]

The only thing I might wonder if she's a bit too acidic, and might need some veggies.



Edited by MaxaLisa (09/08/12 11:19 AM)
_________________________
MaxaL (aka LisaT)

Jazmine, mini-mix, 10/18/2011
Max-n-Indy
Max, 5/2001-2/2012, RIP my partner, my Regal Boy
Indy, 5/1997-10/2010, RIP my friend, my teacher

Health Index
K9 TBD info and Tick List Links
http://www.rabieschallengefund.org/

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#251467 - 09/09/12 05:36 AM Re: Miss Moo is off her rocker :( [Re: MaxaLisa]
bianca Offline
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Registered: 05/14/10
Posts: 8875
Loc: Queensland. Australia
Likes: 149
Thank you Lisa, I really don't understand!

She has steamed beans, peas, brocolli and cauliflower every night to try and fill her up.
_________________________
Molly Moo (aka The Piranha, 4 legged mouth) GSD (31/10/09)
Cooper GSD (The Gremlin) 19/10/11
Texas - Tabby cat (Feb 1996-2013) Run free sweet Teppie
Paris - Tabby cat (Feb 1996-2013) Run free my beautiful girl.

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#251524 - 09/09/12 02:38 PM Re: Miss Moo is off her rocker :( [Re: bianca]
MaxaLisa Offline

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Loc: Northern CA
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What I'm thinking is that her acid/alkali is a bit off, but I don't understand that stuff much at all, despite trying to. The deeper I look at it, the more I confuse myself. So, I guess I don't understand either crazy

So, in addition to the above, what else is she fed?

We had a dog at training, has been a reactive for years, I helped train her when she first came to training as a younger dog a LONG time ago. She belongs to one of the trainers out there. Just recently the owner added green beans to the diet, and there has been a huge turn around in behaviour - it's just amazing. We don't understand it. I'm guessing it can work both ways.

So, since nothing else is showing up, I really would look at something that is too much, or not enough. It might even be the need of some of the stuff that is in the supplement that Bonnie posted about. Of course, if this is an isolated incident, there are no worries. Retesting in a year (6 months if something worrisome comes up), in my mind, is to make sure that we make sure that bloodwork doesn't progress. Maybe with the diet she is on, that higher Hct and Bicarb is her normal, but you want to make sure that it's a consistent level, and not increasing.
_________________________
MaxaL (aka LisaT)

Jazmine, mini-mix, 10/18/2011
Max-n-Indy
Max, 5/2001-2/2012, RIP my partner, my Regal Boy
Indy, 5/1997-10/2010, RIP my friend, my teacher

Health Index
K9 TBD info and Tick List Links
http://www.rabieschallengefund.org/

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#251603 - 09/10/12 04:12 AM Re: Miss Moo is off her rocker :( [Re: MaxaLisa]
bianca Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 05/14/10
Posts: 8875
Loc: Queensland. Australia
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Thank you so much Lisa. She has been much better the last few days, no shaking. Although she doesn't really want to go outside (esp in the morning) and Cooper doesn't want to come inside!!!!

She has been half raw fed/half kibble for about 3 months now. She was on 100% raw but when we moved, well I haven't been able to find a good cheap butcher. And paying around $5 per kilo is a bit too much to cope with.

I will retest her thank you. I just don't know where to start with adding or subtracting something. So I think unless she flips out again, I will leave as is???
_________________________
Molly Moo (aka The Piranha, 4 legged mouth) GSD (31/10/09)
Cooper GSD (The Gremlin) 19/10/11
Texas - Tabby cat (Feb 1996-2013) Run free sweet Teppie
Paris - Tabby cat (Feb 1996-2013) Run free my beautiful girl.

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#251727 - 09/11/12 04:12 AM Re: Miss Moo is off her rocker :( [Re: bianca]
MaxaLisa Offline

Global Moderator

Registered: 01/26/10
Posts: 19487
Loc: Northern CA
Likes: 256
Is it possible that she is having gas or bloating (not "bloat", but more regular bloat), that is throwing her off?
_________________________
MaxaL (aka LisaT)

Jazmine, mini-mix, 10/18/2011
Max-n-Indy
Max, 5/2001-2/2012, RIP my partner, my Regal Boy
Indy, 5/1997-10/2010, RIP my friend, my teacher

Health Index
K9 TBD info and Tick List Links
http://www.rabieschallengefund.org/

Top Likes: 0 
#251739 - 09/11/12 07:48 AM Re: Miss Moo is off her rocker :( [Re: MaxaLisa]
bianca Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 05/14/10
Posts: 8875
Loc: Queensland. Australia
Likes: 149
Yes that is possible! Especially due to that darn broccoli and cauliflower!!! laugh So tonight before bed I will give her a charcoal tablet and see if she is more settled in the morning. Thank you Lisa, that is a great idea!
_________________________
Molly Moo (aka The Piranha, 4 legged mouth) GSD (31/10/09)
Cooper GSD (The Gremlin) 19/10/11
Texas - Tabby cat (Feb 1996-2013) Run free sweet Teppie
Paris - Tabby cat (Feb 1996-2013) Run free my beautiful girl.

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#251764 - 09/11/12 09:46 AM Re: Miss Moo is off her rocker :( [Re: bianca]
BowWowMeow Offline
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Registered: 02/11/10
Posts: 4748
Loc: Buffalo
Likes: 127
Wait a minute...I just remembered something that might help. Chama went through a phase where she was waking up in the middle of the night every night. She just couldn't get comfortable! We would take her outside and she would just stand and stare out the front gate. I thought she was seeing ghosts or something!!!!!! Anyway, I finally figured out that she was allergic to the protein I was feeding her (turkey). I changed her diet and she stopped getting up in the night.

So, I think you're on to something...
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Ruth

Rafi, the german malaroo, age 9.5ish
http://www.dogster.com/dogs/693238

Varda & Gio (the crazy cattens)
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Kai
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#251782 - 09/11/12 10:49 AM Re: Miss Moo is off her rocker :( [Re: BowWowMeow]
MaxaLisa Offline

Global Moderator

Registered: 01/26/10
Posts: 19487
Loc: Northern CA
Likes: 256
:crosedfingers: would be great if there were an easy-ish fix!
_________________________
MaxaL (aka LisaT)

Jazmine, mini-mix, 10/18/2011
Max-n-Indy
Max, 5/2001-2/2012, RIP my partner, my Regal Boy
Indy, 5/1997-10/2010, RIP my friend, my teacher

Health Index
K9 TBD info and Tick List Links
http://www.rabieschallengefund.org/

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