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#344696 - 07/12/17 04:29 PM Re: New AKC Obedience Regs? [Re: Kayos]
Codmaster Offline
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Originally Posted By: Kayos
And in all honesty in real life I doubt I would leave my dog out of site on a stay.


Would it be the possible action of other dogs, or lack of belief in yours that would you not be willing to leave yours out of sight?

In the trials I have been at or in the "out of sight" would be an exageration mostly as the handlers were not very far away and usually just behind a building or trailer or in a few cases just a tent. The dogs clearly knew where the owners were.

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#344699 - 07/12/17 06:36 PM Re: New AKC Obedience Regs? [Re: Codmaster]
PositiveDog Offline
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Speaking for myself, in real life the fears would be: dog thieves, someone poisoning them, someone physically hurting them, other animals and general liability.

I can't think of any reason it would be worth doing.

I knew something who owned a dog related business. She had great pride leaving her dogs at a stay on the sidewalk outside wherever she got her lunch.

It served no purpose other than her stoking her ego.
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Bonnie

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SamCat, 03/2011

Seiko, Solo, Sophie, Skye and Buddy - bridge dogs who taught me so much

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#344701 - 07/13/17 12:07 AM Re: New AKC Obedience Regs? [Re: PositiveDog]
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Dog thieves at a dog show when the audience is there and the handlers are out of sight for 3 and 5 minutes. Poison? hurting a dog (Judge and/or stewards?), other animals? Heh! Heh! Seriously? Maybe i must have misunderstood you.


I think a reliable "Stay" is an absolutely required obedience skill! (right up there with a recall) But that is just my personal opinion, of course and any and all are certainly free to disagree.

Interesting topic to hear all the varied opinions!

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#344703 - 07/13/17 02:25 AM Re: New AKC Obedience Regs? [Re: Codmaster]
middleofnowhere Offline
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Leaving the dog (although if I remember right on tie out) is part of the BH in Schutzhund/IPO

There ARE times when you may need to leave your dog

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#344704 - 07/13/17 02:36 AM Re: New AKC Obedience Regs? [Re: middleofnowhere]
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Originally Posted By: middleofnowhere
Leaving the dog (although if I remember right on tie out) is part of the BH in Schutzhund/IPO

There ARE times when you may need to leave your dog


Very True!

The last I heard (last year) the dog is left on a long down off leash about 30' away from handler who has to keep his/her back to the dog while the 2nd dog in the field goes thru most of their obedience routine.

Could be up to 15-20 minutes (I counted it a couple of times while we were practicing!) that the dog is in a long down while the other dog does their thing.

A challenge - not quite out of sight but a good ways from the handler.

Was a lot of "Fun" for many handlers in my IPO club to train for. All GSDs with just a few Dobies in the club!

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#344706 - 07/13/17 09:09 AM Re: New AKC Obedience Regs? [Re: Codmaster]
PositiveDog Offline
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Kayos said "in real life" not at shows. Yes, you did misunderstand and you brought your past condescending self to the post.

I see some things never change. I should have stayed with my first thought and not responded to you.

In REAL LIFE those are reasons I would not leave my dog out of sight in public.
_________________________
Bonnie

www.dogtors.com

With approval of my friends:

SamCat, 03/2011

Seiko, Solo, Sophie, Skye and Buddy - bridge dogs who taught me so much

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#344707 - 07/13/17 12:43 PM Re: New AKC Obedience Regs? [Re: PositiveDog]
middleofnowhere Offline
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CM - That's the long down. In the BH the handler leaves the dog as in goes out of sight until called back by the judge.

There are reasons to train for this and there are reasons to not do it in real life. Depends on the dog, the situation, the handler -- all situations require evaluation.

Once a well meaning person decided to walk my dog when I had left her in a down stay. She got an earful from me.

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#344708 - 07/13/17 04:01 PM Re: New AKC Obedience Regs? [Re: PositiveDog]
Codmaster Offline
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Originally Posted By: PositiveDog
Kayos said "in real life" not at shows. Yes, you did misunderstand and you brought your past condescending self to the post.

I see some things never change. I should have stayed with my first thought and not responded to you.

In REAL LIFE those are reasons I would not leave my dog out of sight in public.


Bonnie - Excuse me for missing "Real Life" did I also miss where she said "not at shows"?

Thank you for noticing it - another nice insult again from you as well. = "past condescending self"! I really wish you had stayed with your "first thought" and stayed out of it as well. But "some things never change".

Just out of my curiosity does your stage name "positive dog" reflect your training approach. Please stay cool - no condencession intended - just curious.

As far as training a dog to be able to hold a stay out of sight or not - up to the trainer to decide; with my own dogs and the ones I have seen personally; it is just a matter of training and the dogs nerves.

I agree that some dogs would have difficulty in being able to do this - either in public or in a trial. Nerve/confidence issue for some. If I had a dog with this problem, I certainly would not push them to do it. As far as fearing stealing a dog or hurting a dog or poisoning a dog - WOW! I would not leave my dog in a public spot where I was afraid this would happen - must be a terrible neighborhood for sure. In fact, I would not like to even train my dog at all in such a location. We did a lot of training in a nearby city's streets and never even considered such problems.

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#344709 - 07/13/17 04:08 PM Re: New AKC Obedience Regs? [Re: middleofnowhere]
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Originally Posted By: middleofnowhere
CM - That's the long down. In the BH the handler leaves the dog as in goes out of sight until called back by the judge.

There are reasons to train for this and there are reasons to not do it in real life. Depends on the dog, the situation, the handler -- all situations require evaluation.

Once a well meaning person decided to walk my dog when I had left her in a down stay. She got an earful from me.


Yes it is the "Long Down" and a fun exercise to train a dog for, esp. when the two dogs are good friends. Great distraction!

Doing it "in real life" whatever that means to anyone - in a public street, in a crowded training class, in a crowded back yard, in a parking lot, vets office or anywhere; to me is a great way to "Proof" the stay behavior.
Of course i would never recommend that anyone do it where their dog could be in danger! That would really be stupid. Like having a dog practice a stay right next to a busy highway!!!!!!

Having someone try to walk your dog - WOW!
I can imagine what I would have said. I don't think he would have went with a stranger however, but from the looks of my old guy I don't think that very many people would have tried to pick up his leash at any rate.

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#344710 - 07/13/17 04:17 PM Re: New AKC Obedience Regs? [Re: Codmaster]
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Bonnie - never mind my question in my post above about your training approach - I saw your website. Thanks.

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