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#345025 - 08/29/17 02:33 PM Questions about hypothyroidism
Karin Offline
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Registered: 02/11/10
Posts: 900
Loc: San Jose, California
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Heidi has been tested many times for hypothyroidism and the values always come out normal, and they did in last week's blood test as well. However, they are on the low side of normal (which our vet didn't think was a problem) and I'm wondering if some of her symptoms could be a result of this. The thyroid values were as follows: T4 was 11.4 (range is 8-40) and total thyroid was 1.1 (range is .08-3.5)

For the last couple of weeks, she has been extremely low energy, to the point of not even wanting to go for a walk. When I try to take her, she'll pull back and want to turn around and go back home (even before we pass the house next door!) She used to love going for walks. I really don't think she has any hip pain because, although her hindquarters are weak, she isn't limping and I don't see her being in pain.

When I checked the low thyroid symptoms, here are some others she's had for a while: very dull, thin coat; loss of appetite (although I read that an increased appetite is more the norm); sleeps a lot more than usual; very low energy (sleeps most of the day). Plus, I just read that seizures can be caused by this and I believe she's had some focal or mild seizure-like activity on and off lately.

Our vet is wonderful, but maybe a bit on the conservative side with blood tests, etc., so I wanted to see what people here say before I pursue it. I saw that there is tons of info about thyroid issues on the site, but it's a bit daunting and I have huge work project I'm trying to finish up on that is going to be due soon, so I was hoping to get some of the great minds here to give me some words of wisdom! Thank you in advance!
_________________________
Karin and Dave

Heidi, 11-year-old GSD
Adopted on 10/14/07 from: German Shepherd Rescue of Northern California (http://www.savegsd.org)

Sheba, GSD/Malamute angel

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#345026 - 08/29/17 09:34 PM Re: Questions about hypothyroidism [Re: Karin]
Cassidy's Mom Offline
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Loc: SF Bay Area
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Keefer was checked several years ago and his levels were within normal ranges, but on the lower end. There weren't any particular symptoms we'd noticed, it was a routine senior screening. Our vet thought he'd benefit from thyroid meds, so he's been on it ever since, and his levels a month ago were pretty much dead center normal. The meds are very inexpensive, he gets one pill twice a day, and it's around $40.00 for a two month supply.

Have you discussed putting her on thyroid meds with your vet? Here are Keef's 7/25/17 values with his 6/27/14 values following in parenthesis. The initial results are similar to Heidi's but a bit higher:

Total T4 - 1.8 (1.4)
Free T4 - 23.2 (12.9)

I don't think there would be any harm in trying thyroid meds, at least to see if you notice a difference. Personally, I would ask him to prescribe some for her.

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#345027 - 08/29/17 09:38 PM Re: Questions about hypothyroidism [Re: Karin]
Wisc.Tiger_Val Offline
Member First - Owner Second "The Watcher"

Registered: 01/18/10
Posts: 8649
Loc: Wisconsin
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Karin, do you have the dates and values from previous tests?

I hope Lisa sees this, she is so good with all the values of different tests.
_________________________
Val da Tiger

Fuzzybutt the cat.

RIP Cheyenne - AKA: Digger, CheyChey Girl, Cheyenne Large and In charge. 2/16/02 - 2/27/16
RIP DeeDee - AKA: DD Poo, Little Bit, Binky (part of the Binky and Booboo team) 6/23/02-6/20/11
RIP Lakota - AKA: Bubba, Big Boy, BooBoo (the other part of the Binky and BooBoo team). 1/19/03-9/19/2011
RIP Raya - AKA: Raz-a, Ray a Sunshine, RayBestos, the little one, Silly Girl. 9/21/05 - 6/27/14

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#345029 - 08/30/17 11:45 AM Re: Questions about hypothyroidism [Re: Wisc.Tiger_Val]
Mary Jane Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 02/16/10
Posts: 2658
Likes: 118
You may also want to try Jean Dodd's Hemopet thyroid tests. They have a larger range of hormones they measure and the standards they use are breed and age specific.

http://www.hemopet.org/hemolife-diagnostics/veterinary-thyroid-testing.html

all the best to you and Heidi,
MJ

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#345030 - 08/30/17 03:10 PM Re: Questions about hypothyroidism [Re: Mary Jane]
Karin Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 02/11/10
Posts: 900
Loc: San Jose, California
Likes: 15
Thanks for the comments, advice, and well wishes, everyone! It's very much appreciated!

I'll try and find her previous blood test results for the thyroid panel and post them.

And thanks for sharing your experience with Keefer, Debbie. His results are so similar to hers. Did you notice any difference in him after he started taking the thyroid meds? What is the name of the medication that Keefer uses?

Thanks again, all!!
_________________________
Karin and Dave

Heidi, 11-year-old GSD
Adopted on 10/14/07 from: German Shepherd Rescue of Northern California (http://www.savegsd.org)

Sheba, GSD/Malamute angel

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#345032 - 08/30/17 09:28 PM Re: Questions about hypothyroidism [Re: Karin]
Cassidy's Mom Offline
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Loc: SF Bay Area
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Karin, Keef didn't have any symptoms that we'd noticed prior to going on the thyroid meds so we didn't really see a difference. Not that I can remember anyway, this was 3 years ago. I wouldn't have remembered how long he'd been on them, or what his last test results were, but they were right there along the side of the recent test. The low/normal values were discovered in a routine senior screening and in our vet's experience, even though they're still technically "normal", older dogs can benefit from the meds. Many years ago, he prescribed thyroid meds for Sneaker when she was older and had low/normal results too. It was more of a proactive measure with both of them.

Keefer gets Thyro Tabs, the .8 mg ones. One time when I got a refill it was a different name, but when I googled it, it was basically the same medication just a different brand. I don't think it would hurt to try, and it may very well help.

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#345042 - 09/01/17 01:11 AM Re: Questions about hypothyroidism [Re: Cassidy's Mom]
middleofnowhere Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 02/22/10
Posts: 2632
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OK I'll wake up here. Barker the Elder 2nd has a thyroid what? abnormality? Anyway, she is on a little blue pill once a day. The symptom I remember was weight gain. And that's been taken care of with the pill. Cheapest medication that dog has, too.

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#345044 - 09/01/17 02:46 AM Re: Questions about hypothyroidism [Re: middleofnowhere]
MaxaLisa Offline

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Registered: 01/26/10
Posts: 19428
Loc: Northern CA
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Just seeing the Heidi threads now, sorry!

I would definitely do a trial of thyroid. You are seeing symptoms (anxiety, seizure like acticity) and have low normal values. I wouldn't even bother with additional testing.

Max was about 75 lbs and took .8 in the morning and .7 in the evening. When we started he was not low but low normal. He was the only dog that my vet treated that didn't have overt signs, but I talked her into it because he was never right. It did help his anxiety some (not as much as I would have liked), but we never realized he didn't have an under coat until it started growing in. It was gorgeous and we had no clue his fur was as bad as it was. Guess we didn't know enough about shepherds at that time.
_________________________
MaxaL (aka LisaT)

Jazmine, mini-mix, 10/18/2011
Max-n-Indy
Max, 5/2001-2/2012, RIP my partner, my Regal Boy
Indy, 5/1997-10/2010, RIP my friend, my teacher

Health Index
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#345046 - 09/01/17 12:10 PM Re: Questions about hypothyroidism [Re: MaxaLisa]
Cassidy's Mom Offline
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Originally Posted By: MaxaLisa
Max was about 75 lbs and took .8 in the morning and .7 in the evening. When we started he was not low but low normal. He was the only dog that my vet treated that didn't have overt signs, but I talked her into it because he was never right.


I'm so glad my vet suggested it and I didn't have to insist because I wouldn't have had any idea that that thyroid meds could benefit seniors that were still within normal ranges. We probably avoided any symptoms by having Keef go on the med several years ago.

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#345056 - 09/02/17 02:08 PM Re: Questions about hypothyroidism [Re: Cassidy's Mom]
MaxaLisa Offline

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I agree about how great it was that the vet suggested it. I actually had to switch vets to get Max treated frown It was a battle. I would hate to have to deal with the other symptoms that would have crept up while we were waiting for it to go low enough on the lab tests!
_________________________
MaxaL (aka LisaT)

Jazmine, mini-mix, 10/18/2011
Max-n-Indy
Max, 5/2001-2/2012, RIP my partner, my Regal Boy
Indy, 5/1997-10/2010, RIP my friend, my teacher

Health Index
K9 TBD info and Tick List Links
http://www.rabieschallengefund.org/

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#345093 - 09/06/17 12:45 AM Re: Questions about hypothyroidism [Re: MaxaLisa]
Karin Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 02/11/10
Posts: 900
Loc: San Jose, California
Likes: 15
Thanks for commenting, Lisa. I hoped you would jump in! I am going to ask my vet to do a trial of thyroid medicine. She's usually pretty agreeable to what I ask of her, so hopefully she will be this time too. Heidi's coat has been so thin and dull for years now. It sure would be great if it improved like Max's did. And it would be really, really great if her other issues were helped too.
_________________________
Karin and Dave

Heidi, 11-year-old GSD
Adopted on 10/14/07 from: German Shepherd Rescue of Northern California (http://www.savegsd.org)

Sheba, GSD/Malamute angel

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#345098 - 09/06/17 08:48 AM Re: Questions about hypothyroidism [Re: MaxaLisa]
Braverhund Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 02/10/10
Posts: 5397
Loc: Massachusetts
Likes: 154
Karin, mit sending your dear Heidi good thoughts! I'm glad you gave a vet who is receptive to your thoughts. I'm wishing good things for Heidi!
_________________________
Patti
Frauchen von:

Grimm van den Heuvel, "Donnerpratzen"
Smokey The TeddyLion, DLH purrbuddy

Dir gehört mein Herz

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#345101 - 09/06/17 10:40 AM Re: Questions about hypothyroidism [Re: Braverhund]
Karin Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 02/11/10
Posts: 900
Loc: San Jose, California
Likes: 15
Thank you so much for your kind words and good thoughts, Patti. It's so hard when our beloved companions get old and have these different health problems. Heidi is actually pretty healthy other than just a couple of things, but the anxiety (actually, more like terror at times) is so hard to deal with.
_________________________
Karin and Dave

Heidi, 11-year-old GSD
Adopted on 10/14/07 from: German Shepherd Rescue of Northern California (http://www.savegsd.org)

Sheba, GSD/Malamute angel

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#345119 - 09/06/17 09:37 PM Re: Questions about hypothyroidism [Re: Karin]
SeanRescueMom Offline
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Registered: 02/14/10
Posts: 2450
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Originally Posted By: Karin
It's so hard when our beloved companions get old and have these different health problems. Heidi is actually pretty healthy other than just a couple of things, but the anxiety (actually, more like terror at times) is so hard to deal with.


I know, we suffer along with them and just want to fix everything. Hugs to Heidi and you. hugging
_________________________
Sean - 1998/2014
If there ever comes a day when we can't be together, keep me in your heart I'll stay there forever.
Carleton DOB unknown
Neely - 2003/2015
Gizmo -2008/2011
Neeko -1991/2005

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#345141 - 09/08/17 01:01 PM Re: Questions about hypothyroidism [Re: SeanRescueMom]
MaxaLisa Offline

Global Moderator

Registered: 01/26/10
Posts: 19428
Loc: Northern CA
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Keep us posted!
_________________________
MaxaL (aka LisaT)

Jazmine, mini-mix, 10/18/2011
Max-n-Indy
Max, 5/2001-2/2012, RIP my partner, my Regal Boy
Indy, 5/1997-10/2010, RIP my friend, my teacher

Health Index
K9 TBD info and Tick List Links
http://www.rabieschallengefund.org/

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#345142 - 09/08/17 05:27 PM Re: Questions about hypothyroidism [Re: MaxaLisa]
Karin Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 02/11/10
Posts: 900
Loc: San Jose, California
Likes: 15
Thanks for all the support, guys!

I called my vet and she agreed to do a trial of the thyroid replacement. I picked up the bottle today and it just says "Thyro-care" and it's .3 mg and I'm supposed to give it twice a day. I wish they were Thyro-tab like you guys got as I was looking online and it said that those were the only ones approved for use (this was in 2016). My vet is on vacation for the next two weeks, so I can't ask her about it.

Are these tablets pretty safe? Anything I should look out for? It doesn't really say when to take it. Did you guys give it with meals? Do you think it's OK to take with Cholodin & CBD oil? I have a tendency to be a real worry wart when it comes to my precious Heidi!! smile
_________________________
Karin and Dave

Heidi, 11-year-old GSD
Adopted on 10/14/07 from: German Shepherd Rescue of Northern California (http://www.savegsd.org)

Sheba, GSD/Malamute angel

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#345145 - 09/08/17 09:36 PM Re: Questions about hypothyroidism [Re: Karin]
Woodreb Online   coffee
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Registered: 02/18/10
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My old girl Rica was on a thyroid medication a long time ago and I believe my vet had said to give it a couple of hours before or after a meal, no at meal time.
_________________________
Johanna

Caleb (aka Caleb-Moose)
Ciara(aka Ciara Belle, Black Devil)

RIP Aodhán, Rica, Max, Kelly - gone but never forgotten - forever in my heart

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#345153 - 09/09/17 05:01 PM Re: Questions about hypothyroidism [Re: Woodreb]
MaxaLisa Offline

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Registered: 01/26/10
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Loc: Northern CA
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Definitely separate from mealtime so it works optimally. I think that's a low dose (can't remember the weight). I think we started low and then ramped up to the recommended dose for the weight.
_________________________
MaxaL (aka LisaT)

Jazmine, mini-mix, 10/18/2011
Max-n-Indy
Max, 5/2001-2/2012, RIP my partner, my Regal Boy
Indy, 5/1997-10/2010, RIP my friend, my teacher

Health Index
K9 TBD info and Tick List Links
http://www.rabieschallengefund.org/

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#345176 - 09/12/17 07:19 PM Re: Questions about hypothyroidism [Re: Karin]
PositiveDog Offline
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Registered: 02/20/10
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Buddy has been on 0.5 mg of thyro-tabs for years. He also takes cholodin and cbd oil. I wouldn't be concerned with the combination

Originally I was told to give at least an hour away from foods to be effective. Since then my schedule changed and that was impossible. I now give it with his meals.

His bloodwork is run yearly at a minimum and his levels have stayed steady over the years. If possible, I would prefer not to give it at meal time, but we do the best we can.

I hope this trial goes well for you.


Edited by PositiveDog (09/12/17 07:27 PM)
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Bonnie

www.dogtors.com

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SamCat, 03/2011

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#345637 - 10/16/17 12:47 AM Re: Questions about hypothyroidism [Re: PositiveDog]
Karin Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 02/11/10
Posts: 900
Loc: San Jose, California
Likes: 15
Well, Heidi has been on the thyroid medicine for about 2 weeks now and she's really doing well. Her appetite is better and she's gained a couple of pounds. She's not so scared anymore. Every once in a while, she'll get nervous, but she gets over it fairly quickly. She's sleeping through the night. She has more energy and will go for a walk without trying to turn around and go back home again. And her fur is already looking a little better. It's really pretty amazing.

And none of that "seizure-like activity" of nose lifting and trembling has happened at all for the past couple of weeks. No more horrible panic attacks either, where she's shaking and inconsolable. I think part of that might have been due to giving her too much cholodin. I had been giving her 2 tablets with breakfast and 2 with dinner. I think that with her weight loss, it was too much for her. She's down to 3/4 tablet with BF and 3/4 tablet with dinner.

The only problem is that it's making her feel so good that she's a little more reactive to other dogs than she was before. She was always that way when we first got her, but as she got older, she got a little more mellow. Now, she's feeling her oats again! It's not really a problem because we're used to this and don't let other dogs approach her when we take her for walks. I just don't want her to cause any trouble at doggie daycare, where she's been going for the past 9 years!

We'll take her in to get retested in two more weeks, but I really think this is making a big difference already. I give her the tablet 1 hour before meals with a tiny bit of peanut butter. Thanks for the tips and great advice!
_________________________
Karin and Dave

Heidi, 11-year-old GSD
Adopted on 10/14/07 from: German Shepherd Rescue of Northern California (http://www.savegsd.org)

Sheba, GSD/Malamute angel

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#345642 - 10/16/17 09:02 AM Re: Questions about hypothyroidism [Re: Karin]
SeanRescueMom Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 02/14/10
Posts: 2450
Likes: 74
So glad to hear Heidi is feeling her oats again thanks to the thyroid medicine along with advice from Lisa and Deb. thumbup Please keep us posted on her progress.
_________________________
Sean - 1998/2014
If there ever comes a day when we can't be together, keep me in your heart I'll stay there forever.
Carleton DOB unknown
Neely - 2003/2015
Gizmo -2008/2011
Neeko -1991/2005

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#345649 - 10/16/17 07:27 PM Re: Questions about hypothyroidism [Re: SeanRescueMom]
Shilohsmom Online   content
Veteran

Registered: 02/11/10
Posts: 1479
Likes: 150
Somehow I missed this frown Glad to hear our dear Heidi is doing better. Please keep us posted.
hugging
_________________________
Rosa

Proud Mom to Shoshi, Eli and Kodiak
and never to be forgotten, Shiloh
Every dog deserves to have a human that thinks its the greatest dog that ever lived!

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#345768 - 10/22/17 09:58 PM Re: Questions about hypothyroidism [Re: Shilohsmom]
MaxaLisa Offline

Global Moderator

Registered: 01/26/10
Posts: 19428
Loc: Northern CA
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Glad to hear that things have improved with the thyroid trial!
_________________________
MaxaL (aka LisaT)

Jazmine, mini-mix, 10/18/2011
Max-n-Indy
Max, 5/2001-2/2012, RIP my partner, my Regal Boy
Indy, 5/1997-10/2010, RIP my friend, my teacher

Health Index
K9 TBD info and Tick List Links
http://www.rabieschallengefund.org/

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#345779 - 10/23/17 03:43 PM Re: Questions about hypothyroidism [Re: MaxaLisa]
Wisc.Tiger_Val Offline
Member First - Owner Second "The Watcher"

Registered: 01/18/10
Posts: 8649
Loc: Wisconsin
Likes: 255
Glad to hear that Heidi is feeling better now. Makes me smile when you said she is feeling her Oats again.
_________________________
Val da Tiger

Fuzzybutt the cat.

RIP Cheyenne - AKA: Digger, CheyChey Girl, Cheyenne Large and In charge. 2/16/02 - 2/27/16
RIP DeeDee - AKA: DD Poo, Little Bit, Binky (part of the Binky and Booboo team) 6/23/02-6/20/11
RIP Lakota - AKA: Bubba, Big Boy, BooBoo (the other part of the Binky and BooBoo team). 1/19/03-9/19/2011
RIP Raya - AKA: Raz-a, Ray a Sunshine, RayBestos, the little one, Silly Girl. 9/21/05 - 6/27/14

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