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#19142 - 03/13/10 11:31 PM perianal fistulas - scared for skye
PositiveDog Online   coffee
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 02/20/10
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As part of the GSD boards for some time, I have always made it a point to read the posts in the health sections daily. That's why Skye was diagnosed very early with an eye specialist when she developed pannus.

Pannus is fairly easily managed with Skye - ointment in her eye once or twice day depending on the brightness of the light or snow.

This time, Skye may not be so lucky. I already know almost 100% in my brain, but not in my heart, that she has perianal fistulas.

First it was just excessive licking for no known reason - not even red looking. Then she did look a little red, then the area all around her anus became very swollen. I am talking probably a half an inch or more high all around.

But hey - nothing else, right? And the swelling went down. Home free?

Yesterday she had sort of red spots and 'weeping' and today it is worse. I was hoping to take her this Friday when I am off work to MedVet in Columbus where the specialists are. I don't think I can wait that long.

I will contact them in the morning to see if I can get her in earlier.

I hope I am wrong.

Poor Skye - she is a rescue and poorly bred, but such a sweet wonderful dog. She visits kids in the library and people at mental health group sessions. She demos obedience classes for me and is a steady calm dog in every situation (except for having to bark back all those animals into TV so they don't get me.)

Lisa - thank you for the words of wisdom and hope on my PM last week. I don't think we are going to be lucky on this one.

Sorry this is so long - I am so sad and scared and feel so helpless. Our dogs don't deserve things like this.
_________________________
Bonnie

With approval of my friends:

SamCat, 03/2011

Seiko, Solo, Sophie, Skye and Buddy - bridge dogs who taught me so much

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#19152 - 03/13/10 11:38 PM Re: perianal fistulas - scared for skye [Re: PositiveDog]
Braverhund Offline
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Oh, Bonnie.. I know this is scary. Skye and you both deserve the very best, so may your suspicions not be true on this one! When will you have her examined? It may also be that she began a lick-lick-lick cycle, and the skin there is swollen and inflamed, and you can get weepiness with irritated skin. She may also have impacted glands (though I know you would know to look for anal gland issues too). I am hoping that this is NOT fistulas. If it is, the yahoo groups and PF forums may offer iseas and support. Lisa will surely weigh in and add her advice! I will be sending positiv, healing e thoughts and vibes for Skye, and really hope for an encouraging update!
_________________________
Patti
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#19154 - 03/13/10 11:40 PM Re: perianal fistulas - scared for skye [Re: PositiveDog]
MaxaLisa Offline

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teary I'm so sorry Bonnie hugging My heart aches to read this post.

For now, soaking in warm compress soaked in Epsom salt water will help her feel better.

Many vets are not up on the most recent research. Some dogs (like Max), don't fall in line with the most recent research.

The first step, recommended in nearly all cases, is for a change to a single (novel) protein, single carb/starch food, no corn, no wheat.

This is so not what I wanted to read hugging

edit: just read Patti's post - maybe it's the glands????? maybe we can hold out hope for that...is it in the same general area as the pic Lauri posted in her thread?


Edited by MaxaLisa (03/13/10 11:43 PM)
_________________________
MaxaL (aka LisaT)

Jazmine, mini-mix, 10/18/2011
Max-n-Indy
Max, 5/2001-2/2012, RIP my partner, my Regal Boy
Indy, 5/1997-10/2010, RIP my friend, my teacher

Health Index
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#19162 - 03/13/10 11:46 PM Re: perianal fistulas - scared for skye [Re: PositiveDog]
Doggonefool Offline
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I am so sorry to read about the difficulties that you are having with Skye. The education that we find on this board, especially in the health section, are both a comfort and a worry. I find that the more that I learn, the more that I worry. But the more that I know, the quicker and better I am able to recognize and help.

Our dogs, our pets, are everything to us. Wishing you nothing but the best for your.
_________________________
Carol
Ranger 9yo BSD
River 2 yo GSD
Jukka & Loki 2 yo Alaskan Husky sibs
***Rainbow Bridge - Whimsey, Sparkie, Draco, Smokie, Blondie, Muffie***

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#19166 - 03/13/10 11:53 PM Re: perianal fistulas - scared for skye [Re: MaxaLisa]
Elmos Mom Offline
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Bonnie, you're right. Our dogs don't deserve some of the things they go through. Skye sounds like an absolute sweetheart. The poor baby. It's difficult because they can't tell us their symptoms so we're relying on their queues and symptoms to figure out how serious something may be.

Please let us know what the vet says tomorrow. Sending lots of good thoughts.
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Mommy to:
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Molly, 11 year old Jack Russell

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#19169 - 03/13/10 11:57 PM Re: perianal fistulas - scared for skye [Re: MaxaLisa]
PositiveDog Online   coffee
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I don't believe it is the glands (but that would be wonderful) - I have been through that with my late german shorthair some years ago. Hers often had had to be cared for at the vets and one time did get impacted. This just does not look the same.

On a good note, because both Buddy and Skye have had an itchy winter, I put the dogs on Orijen 6 fish, which is, of course grain free. I was hoping for better coats and (for Buddy) fewer hot spots.

I am glad after what I have read here and other places. They have been on it less than a week. Their prior food was also grain free (CORE) but not single protein.

I chose Orijen 6 Fish over CORE Ocean because Orijen does not use Ethoxyquin as in USA fish.

Hopefully, this will be a good start if Skye is diagnosed.

Thank you for your fast responses. You are both so great to help us.

I will get epsom salt in the morning and begin using compresses.
_________________________
Bonnie

With approval of my friends:

SamCat, 03/2011

Seiko, Solo, Sophie, Skye and Buddy - bridge dogs who taught me so much

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#19172 - 03/14/10 12:00 AM Re: perianal fistulas - scared for skye [Re: PositiveDog]
MaxaLisa Offline

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Max's almost closed with antibiotics. I will hope that Skye is one of the lucky ones.

Other than the pannus, are there other issues? Food allergies (can she tolerate beef?), anything else?
_________________________
MaxaL (aka LisaT)

Jazmine, mini-mix, 10/18/2011
Max-n-Indy
Max, 5/2001-2/2012, RIP my partner, my Regal Boy
Indy, 5/1997-10/2010, RIP my friend, my teacher

Health Index
K9 TBD info and Tick List Links
http://www.rabieschallengefund.org/

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#19183 - 03/14/10 12:13 AM Re: perianal fistulas - scared for skye [Re: MaxaLisa]
PositiveDog Online   coffee
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 02/20/10
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It's been a long time since she had a beef based food. She was on EVO for a long time which is chicken and then I changed to CORE (still chicken.)

She has allergies to dust mites and mold. No food allergies turned up on her HESKA tests.
_________________________
Bonnie

With approval of my friends:

SamCat, 03/2011

Seiko, Solo, Sophie, Skye and Buddy - bridge dogs who taught me so much

Top Likes: 0 
#19193 - 03/14/10 12:30 AM Re: perianal fistulas - scared for skye [Re: PositiveDog]
MaxaLisa Offline

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It is thought that fistulas are related to a condition similar to Crohn's disease, which is what is true in people. In people, they operate. If your vet, any vet, talks about a surgical solution to a PF, time to walk out the door.

Back to my train of thought....I believe that fistulas are related to chronic inflammation. There is a genetic component for most, but not all cases. In some dogs, the inflammation is of an autoimmune nature and these dogs respond to the serious immune suppressive drugs (prednisone, cyclosporine, etc.), in others, like I suspect is true for my Max, it is due to chronic immune malfunction triggered by a chronic infection (in his case, from most likely a tick) and these dogs better respond to things like antibiotics, antifungals. I believe that Max's pannus meds contributed to suppressing his immune function. What are you using to control Skye's eyes?

I have a supplement that I really like for immune system inflammation that does not boost the immune system, it has saved Indy's life many times over. It is beef based, so Max can't take it, which is very frustrating. It might be something worth considering if this turns out to be a fistula. After about three days on it, Max starts chewing his paws to pieces, but for those three days, his eyes sure get better.

I am hopeful about the herb mix that I have started him on, originally recommended by Patti. It's too soon for you to decide what you want to do, you'll want to figure out a first step in conjunction with your vet, but there are things to try....a frequent first step is antibiotics, with metronidazole (we use tylan, Max stumbles on metro).

Until you get an appointment and a plan of action, using some Desitin zinc based ointment can help. For some, it's a huge lifesaver. If there is pain, some on the list use aspirin or apply orajel to the site. I started with the ointment, and then changed to the Burt's Bees version which is their diaper rash version. I went to Walmart and got their Large boxer shorts and put them on backwards (the tail fits through the hole), using a safety bobby pin for infants so that he doesn't lick the area.

The good news is that it can be managed, it's not a death sentence, and you are not alone hugging


Edited by MaxaLisa (03/14/10 12:35 AM)
_________________________
MaxaL (aka LisaT)

Jazmine, mini-mix, 10/18/2011
Max-n-Indy
Max, 5/2001-2/2012, RIP my partner, my Regal Boy
Indy, 5/1997-10/2010, RIP my friend, my teacher

Health Index
K9 TBD info and Tick List Links
http://www.rabieschallengefund.org/

Top Likes: 0 
#19207 - 03/14/10 01:38 AM Re: perianal fistulas - scared for skye [Re: MaxaLisa]
PositiveDog Online   coffee
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 02/20/10
Posts: 4906
Loc: Ohio
Likes: 134
Thank you, Lisa. I will add the Desitin zinc based ointment to my shopping list.

Skye takes cyclosporine for her eyes.

I have also read about the surgery and don't see it as an option - glad to hear you hear you say that. But - a surgery site did have some of the best pictures I have seen. From beginning stages to chronic.

Graphic warning to others. Figure 5 which is supposed to be mild looks worse than Skye does right now.

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/17836754/Perianal-sinus-A-medical-disease

I am glad to hear the Desitin is OK - I am sure that she would not be licking if it was not painful and she seems sad and quiet.

Although - not quiet enough that it kept her from wanting to play toss the stuffed fishy in the middle of the night.

Speaking of the middle of the night - it is late and I need to stop worrying for a few hours. Off to sleep.
_________________________
Bonnie

With approval of my friends:

SamCat, 03/2011

Seiko, Solo, Sophie, Skye and Buddy - bridge dogs who taught me so much

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