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#22902 - 03/22/10 07:30 PM Re: perianal fistulas - scared for skye [Re: PositiveDog]
JakodaCD OA Offline
Veteran

Registered: 02/11/10
Posts: 1378
Loc: Old Lyme CT
Likes: 27
just saw this post, sorry you are going thru this:(( It sounds like Skye is a trooper tho!

I do find it interesting they think the fistula is causing the gland problem as lisa said..It IS usually the other way around, and maybe at a later point, the vet may change her mind.

My first PF dog, had an infected gland, resulted in pf's, so not "true" pf disease. His was cleared up with cryosurgery, they removed the glands and all the pf tracts, not a pretty site, but did the trick.

My second one, blew his gland, (most likely due to infection) resulting in pf's, I treated him with oral cyclo , again, not "true" Pf disease, he had a couple of reoccurrances, I used the desitin which cleared them right up. I would not have hesitated with gland removal if the cyclo didn't work.

Most "true" Pf dogs have other issues as well, I see Skye has pannus:(( I personally don't think I'd use the transferfactor at this point. I'd wait and see if the Cipro /tacro helps first.

I haven't been on the pf email list lately, but at one point, even tho vets were prescribing using the tacro twice a day, I believe it was the concensus that using it ONCE a day and the other time (am & pm) use the desitin. Something about to much tacro wasn't as good as less?? Lisa is probably more 'up" on that suggestion if it's changed.

When I applied the desitin (and I imagine you could do the same with the tacro) I put it on a Q tip and put it IN the tracts as well as around them..

The biggest indicator,if there are no others, is the licking, when it starts to subside, things are 'good':))

Good luck with your journey, I hope Skye feels better soon:))
_________________________
Diane
Ozzie von Kleinen Hain
Jakoda's Kholee
Tranquillo's Kizzy
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"Angel" Harmonyhill's Hy Jynx aka "Jynx"
"Angel" Jakoda's Jagged Edge aka "Jag"
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#22931 - 03/22/10 08:58 PM Re: perianal fistulas - scared for skye [Re: JakodaCD OA]
PositiveDog Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 02/20/10
Posts: 4921
Loc: Ohio
Likes: 136
Thank you for your reply to this and your kind thoughts for Skye.

I think I must have worded it incorrectly since it is being taken that my vet thinks the fistulas 'caused' the gland problem. Partly due to my state of mind last week.

It is more accurate to say that she did not think the glands ALONE were causing the sores she was seeing - meaning it was not just irritation from licking and only an anal gland problem. Instead, the sores were most probably fistulas and cleaning the glands alone would not stop the problem.

At that time, you could see into the sores - but at this time it does appear there are openings. She wanted to go ahead with treating for PF.

I hope that makes more sense - I don't want to put words in my vets mouth.

When I go back on the 30th I will ask about swapping out the desitin for one of the doses. I hope it looks much better than it does now.

By the way - at the moment, Skye is wearing bvds with her tail though the opening. She does NOT think it is cute, but she has decided to leave them on for the time being.

She looks pitiful and does not appreciate boy shorts.

The transferfactor was not for this issue, but for her immune system in general. Do you feel it could cause harm?

I did sign up on the pf email list, but now I can't find my way back. lol
_________________________
Bonnie

With approval of my friends:

SamCat, 03/2011

Seiko, Solo, Sophie, Skye and Buddy - bridge dogs who taught me so much

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#23018 - 03/22/10 10:49 PM Re: perianal fistulas - scared for skye [Re: PositiveDog]
Wisc.Tiger_Val Offline
Member First - Owner Second "The Watcher"

Registered: 01/18/10
Posts: 8794
Loc: Wisconsin
Likes: 268
I have the Bitches Britches for Raya when I took her to training. The place I trained said she could come while she was in season, she just had to wear the britches (this was agility).

She didn't seem to mind them too much, lol better looking than boys shorts.
_________________________
Val da Tiger

Fuzzybutt the cat.
Neilla the Big White puppy.

RIP Cheyenne - AKA: Digger, CheyChey Girl, Cheyenne Large and In charge. 2/16/02 - 2/27/16
RIP Raya - AKA: Raz-a, Ray a Sunshine, RayBestos, the little one, Silly Girl. 9/21/05 - 6/27/14
RIP Lakota - AKA: Bubba, Big Boy, BooBoo (the other part of the Binky and BooBoo team). 1/19/03-9/19/2011
RIP DeeDee - AKA: DD Poo, Little Bit, Binky (part of the Binky and Booboo team) 6/23/02-6/20/11

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#23038 - 03/22/10 11:40 PM Re: perianal fistulas - scared for skye [Re: Wisc.Tiger_Val]
PositiveDog Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 02/20/10
Posts: 4921
Loc: Ohio
Likes: 136
Well, if the britches stay on during agility, they should stay on Skye lounging around the house.

I'll pick her up a pair or two tomorrow.

Thanks!
_________________________
Bonnie

With approval of my friends:

SamCat, 03/2011

Seiko, Solo, Sophie, Skye and Buddy - bridge dogs who taught me so much

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#23056 - 03/23/10 12:08 AM Re: perianal fistulas - scared for skye [Re: JakodaCD OA]
SeanRescueMom Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 02/14/10
Posts: 2564
Likes: 82
Originally Posted By: JakodaCD OA
just saw this post, sorry you are going thru this:(( It sounds like Skye is a trooper tho!


Oh Bonnie, I just saw this post too. I'm so sorry I didn't see it earlier. I will check more regularly and for what it's worth, Sean sends gentle hugs to Skye. wub
_________________________
Sean - 1998/2014
If there ever comes a day when we can't be together, keep me in your heart I'll stay there forever.
Carleton DOB unknown
Neely - 2003/2015
Gizmo -2008/2011
Neeko -1991/2005

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#23062 - 03/23/10 12:32 AM Re: perianal fistulas - scared for skye [Re: PositiveDog]
MaxaLisa Offline

Global Moderator

Registered: 01/26/10
Posts: 19487
Loc: Northern CA
Likes: 256
I will have to get a pic of Max in only his boxers. We have a pretty good routine now, and it only falls off if I don't attach it tight enough. Here's a pic when I first started - I tried using a shirt to hold them on, but soon realized that I didn't need the shirt: http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f179/other95/medical/IMG00116.jpg (ignore the dirty socks on the floor please....) After I put the tail through the hole in the boxers, I pin it above the waist with a safety pin. It stays on while he's crated during the day, and also at night when he sleeps. If he hasn't been licking, I will leave it off at night.

Here's the link to the pf group: http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/PF-L/ It's always in the Health Index if you lose it. It's a fairly high volume list.

It is said that the tacrolimus is too harsh to use twice a day, and they don't recommend using it this way on the list. I never used it twice a day - I was using the tacro during the day, and then the zinc ointment at night. Now I just use the zinc ointment.

I would be very hesitant with the transfer factor. There are some folks that believe TF is good for autoimmune conditions. I don't believe that that's the case. What I believe is that it is immune stimulating, but at the same time you are trying to suppress with the cyclo, so I think they will fight against each other. I wouldn't use it.

It's possible that for some dogs, there is immune suppression, which is probably what is happening with Max. That's not the norm though. I'm wondering how kutzro's dog is doing....

Diane, I was wondering how long it would take you to check in!!

Bonnie, I'm glad that it seems like Skye is feeling playful. I think after the PF's break through, they feel better for a bit - I think when it's blistering and festering inside without an outlet, it's very uncomfortable.
_________________________
MaxaL (aka LisaT)

Jazmine, mini-mix, 10/18/2011
Max-n-Indy
Max, 5/2001-2/2012, RIP my partner, my Regal Boy
Indy, 5/1997-10/2010, RIP my friend, my teacher

Health Index
K9 TBD info and Tick List Links
http://www.rabieschallengefund.org/

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#23093 - 03/23/10 02:40 AM Re: perianal fistulas - scared for skye [Re: MaxaLisa]
BowWowMeow Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 02/11/10
Posts: 4748
Loc: Buffalo
Likes: 127
Sending healing thoughts to Skye and hugs to you, Bonnie!
_________________________
Ruth

Rafi, the german malaroo, age 9.5ish
http://www.dogster.com/dogs/693238

Varda & Gio (the crazy cattens)
...............
Warming my heart:
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Chama
Kai
Basu
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#23419 - 03/23/10 09:29 PM Re: perianal fistulas - scared for skye [Re: BowWowMeow]
PositiveDog Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 02/20/10
Posts: 4921
Loc: Ohio
Likes: 136
Thank you, everyone for you good wishes and your advise.

Skye had a bad day today and is clingy tonight. I could tell her fistulas were painful - she kept twitching when I put the ointment on her with the q-tip. I try to be careful, but I want to be sure it is the 'nooks and crannies.'

She just looks so sore. Does this seem to get worse before it gets better?

She has been on the cipro for a week today and and got the trac ointment last night and tonight. As suggested, I am using desitin with zinc in the mornings. I will be so relieved to see her look better.

I feel more helpless with this than the pannus. At least I know her eyes are under control and not painful. But this - it makes me cry because I can tell she is not well and don't know how much the meds are helping.

She does still play, but for short bursts.

Funny story though - she romped with Buddy and her boy shorts got twisted. She came over to me and whined and turned around so I could help her. Silly dog.
_________________________
Bonnie

With approval of my friends:

SamCat, 03/2011

Seiko, Solo, Sophie, Skye and Buddy - bridge dogs who taught me so much

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#23430 - 03/23/10 09:45 PM Re: perianal fistulas - scared for skye [Re: PositiveDog]
MaxaLisa Offline

Global Moderator

Registered: 01/26/10
Posts: 19487
Loc: Northern CA
Likes: 256
You will feel more helpless with this, it's big league, and it's scary.

With Max, many of the things that were supposed to help made it worse. You have to learn to follow your instincts on what is "better" and what is "worse".

Sometimes they will open up and ooze more when they start healing. But if they start really spreading, or getting worse otherwise, I would check in with your vet. If you want to experiment with some homeopathic remedies to help with the discomfort, I can suggest a few.

I put together the main part of Max's protocol, it's not standard. Instead of Cipro, I put Max on amoxicillin and doxycycline; when was initially put on Cipro, I switched it to doxycycline and half dose Cipro because that's a protocol for Bartonella. There's an article somewhere about the treatment for one of the tick diseases (Babesia) being effective for PF, so I went that route because of Max's previous issues.

If the Cipro doesn't work, I believe that the standard protocol is either pred or cyclo/keto.

Stick with it, but follow your intuition. On the PF list, they will use orajel on the fistula to numb the pain, or low dose aspirin for the pain, with Benadryl.


Edited by MaxaLisa (03/23/10 09:46 PM)
_________________________
MaxaL (aka LisaT)

Jazmine, mini-mix, 10/18/2011
Max-n-Indy
Max, 5/2001-2/2012, RIP my partner, my Regal Boy
Indy, 5/1997-10/2010, RIP my friend, my teacher

Health Index
K9 TBD info and Tick List Links
http://www.rabieschallengefund.org/

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#23446 - 03/23/10 09:55 PM Re: perianal fistulas - scared for skye [Re: MaxaLisa]
PositiveDog Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 02/20/10
Posts: 4921
Loc: Ohio
Likes: 136
Thank you, Lisa. I was just on the yahoo group - my member status is still pending, but I could look at some links. I will continue to study there and most likely will be bugging you more.

I intend to talk to my vet about not using the trac 2X a day. She seems open to new information.

The cyclo scares me with her other problems - we are afraid it could open a whole new world of problems.

I will look more into the keto (I know the full name is spelled out here in the link and will back track to it.)

I so appreciate your help and everyone's understanding. I think I have been fortunate with my dogs. Not so much right now.
_________________________
Bonnie

With approval of my friends:

SamCat, 03/2011

Seiko, Solo, Sophie, Skye and Buddy - bridge dogs who taught me so much

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