Herm Sprenger Problem

Posted by: RaisingBaby

Herm Sprenger Problem - 04/16/17 10:42 PM

Just a warning. The Herm Sprenger suddenly fell off my GSD again today on a busy street. The first time it happened - sure, operator error. The 2nd time... I swear it was right... again - benefit of doubt (something I did wrong.

3rd fail.. no way. So I ordered the HS quick release version. I only use the HS with her when we're starting out on the busy streets again after winter as she needs initial reminders. Today, I took her out on the HS with regular collar to convert. She was 1 day on the HS and doing fine.

HS dropped in the middle of the busy street. Thank God I had her license collar backup on. I heard a "chunk metal" hit the ground and automatically reached down to grab and clip the leash to the regular collar.

Somethings wrong with the HS. It was exactly in proper place and active when it dropped, I was extremely aware of placement this time and in fact was looking at her neck for placement when it just popped off before my eyes. I don't get it - unless long hair around the top neck line is, when it moves just right - causing a link fail. But! I was looking right at the upper neck area when it popped and it was from the 3rd link down on one side! I don't get it. Any similar experiences? Thanks:)
Posted by: RaisingBaby

Re: Herm Sprenger Problem - 04/16/17 11:18 PM

I guess, unless I hear any different that I'll just put her on an old fashioned choke for the next couple of weeks until I can rely on just a regular collar for handling. The HS quick release has not failed me, just the regular. Took the regular because I couldn't locate the quick release from last spring.

Just a strange experience for me with the HS regular. I've read tons of posts and not heard of it before and for the life of me, can't figure out how it is just releasing and dropping mid walk with no pressure or relaxation applied. So weird!
Posted by: middleofnowhere

Re: Herm Sprenger Problem - 04/17/17 01:28 AM

I'd say that the link was compromised, as in tweeked too hard. I don't use the regular ones any more because my grip strength is a far cry from what it used to be (the ravages of time....) If you are worried about the collar failing, use two collars and a coupler to the second one from the lead.
Posted by: Codmaster

Re: Herm Sprenger Problem - 04/17/17 03:09 AM

most folks who use a prong collar also use a "Safety" link - a little connector line between the prong and a regular collar (buckle usually) so that when (Not if) the prong opens you still have a leash on your dog. i had a Herm collar come loose three times in a couple years of use on a daily basis and was glad I had the safety collar hooked up (Last two times anyway!!!!).

just a thought!
Posted by: luvmysheps

Re: Herm Sprenger Problem - 04/17/17 10:15 AM

I was told by my trainer to also hook choker collar so that if prong came loose you still have a collar on your dog.
Posted by: zyp

Re: Herm Sprenger Problem - 04/17/17 10:27 PM

back up your prong with a slip collar like this one
http://leerburg.com/885.htm
Posted by: Braverhund

Re: Herm Sprenger Problem - 04/19/17 09:26 AM

You can also buy a Herm Sprenger prong with a fabric cover, which holds it all together safely.
This us what we use here, with great success. The collar goes easily on and off with a quick release. You can Google and find this. Best success! smile
Posted by: RaisingBaby

Re: Herm Sprenger Problem - 04/22/17 02:13 AM

Thank you. I think that's the answer. She freaks and tries to strangle herself with the fabric slip collar (always has) but is fine with the metal one so I'll use that with the connector.

It's just that no matter what you use for a backup and connector - there will be a decreased response on the quick pop function of the HS. Been there, done that with several back up collars on connectors. The regular old fashioned metal link choke collar has the most minimal though. Thanks:)
Posted by: middleofnowhere

Re: Herm Sprenger Problem - 04/23/17 01:40 PM

I'd just go with the regular flat collar as a back up to the prong if I were having problems with it.

Anyway, glad you have found a solution.
Posted by: Codmaster

Re: Herm Sprenger Problem - 04/25/17 09:15 PM

Originally Posted By: RaisingBaby
Thank you. I think that's the answer. She freaks and tries to strangle herself with the fabric slip collar (always has) but is fine with the metal one so I'll use that with the connector.

It's just that no matter what you use for a backup and connector - there will be a decreased response on the quick pop function of the HS. Been there, done that with several back up collars on connectors. The regular old fashioned metal link choke collar has the most minimal though. Thanks:)


We used a large link Fursaver (like a regular slip collar but with BIG links) as a backup to the prong - worked great and no impact whatsoever to the correction with the prong when needed. Probably doesn't make a big difference what you use as a backup to prong as long as the connection piece is long enough.
Posted by: RaisingBaby

Re: Herm Sprenger Problem - 06/05/17 11:43 PM

Hi all:) Learned more this month about my GSD and wanted to share. I got so frustrated with her this last 6 weeks. Loong winter, then I've had some medical problems and it's my fault totally she slipped in her training.. pretty much all winter.

She wasn't listening to me at all. Barging past me to get out the door. Not listening outside. (She'll be 3 tomorrow). I spent some time yesterday reviewing some very good older articles about drives, nerves, inherited traits vs learned responses. Took a chance this evening that I actually learned to try the best approach to get back on track... and it worked 100%! Every once in a while even us dummies get lucky:)

I ordered her a new round of balls and a "flirt pole" last month. The pole is actually a horse whip (lime green). Took it out back and practiced using it as a whip on an old bush and it really makes a noise. She kinda spooked. I told her it was ok but stay back. Just watched her, called her over, let her sniff it, pet her - she was cool but not up to her crazy run amok antics. The noise brought a natural fear to her.

So, took her in the front yard and for the next 1/2 hour I played good guy/bad guy ball with her re; long distance sit/stays. 1st 2 minutes, she bolted and barked at a couple walking by (the woman actually screamed). I cracked the whip (no where near her) and told her "NO" "DOWN" and she dropped. I apologized and said sorry! she's in training.

The next distractions were ignored- she had total focus on me. She obeyed me! Ball in one hand, several throws and retrieves and then I'd tell her to sit (70 feet away) and we'd to the long down. She was 100% on our session from there on out.

Do dogs take advantage some? I think yes! There's no way this session could have brought results so quickly and consistently if she had not known what I wanted in this exact scenario (which were total failures) in the previous 2 weeks. The whip in my hand brought respect. The last 10 minutes of the session, I just had the whip laying on the ground beside me - same positive results. Now, that leads back to what kind of dog you have... nerve, drive etc and I would appreciate more feedback on that...

But, I'm a pretty happy camper right now:) Thought I lost it all forever with her because of such a long winter break with no training. All I lost was respect (rightfully and understandably so) but - This goofy looking horse whip is my key to get us back in the program.

I realize that I got lucky with this breakthrough and have to be on this training every day now. I will have the whip laying beside me and will only pick it up and crack it if she breaks training but I think she won't need it at all ... until it comes to the prey drive problem - she's a fence fighter.
Posted by: Codmaster

Re: Herm Sprenger Problem - 06/07/17 12:44 PM

what are your plans for her when you don't have the whip with you?
Posted by: Codmaster

Re: Herm Sprenger Problem - 06/07/17 12:45 PM

what are your plans for her when you don't have the whip with you?
Posted by: Kayos

Re: Herm Sprenger Problem - 06/08/17 03:05 PM

Not sure I like the whip idea.
Posted by: middleofnowhere

Re: Herm Sprenger Problem - 06/10/17 10:37 AM

It sounds like at least unorthodox if not inappropriate use of a flirt pole. They are meant to encourage prey drive. I did use a longe whip to call Barker Sisters the First to the house. They thought the snap meant something good was going to happen, it didn't instill fear.

If you are relying on the noise to = "right now this minute" you could likely use something smaller that made a very similar noise (cap devise?, clapping two boards together) Another option would be to begin pairing the snap of the whip to another cue and phasing out the whip.